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#16
Eleazar

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we're not gonna get a $2m per yr type of player. and we won't get a guy as good/valued as Kaku. it'll be Rza/Royer level type of guy, lower TAM sub $1m in salary.


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#17
uptownbull

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yawn
How many cups did Henry and Cahill bring us?? 
 
We need more Kaku level signings.  Add another player like him/Piatti/Valeri on the wing last year - different story


I agree with the second point 100% despite it drawing sharp rebukes on RBNY twitter (lol, I love it and y'all), but the first point is maddening.

Henry changed this teams perception of itself, and I don't think BWP is the player he is today without Henry's example/inspiration/endless haranguing. To say that bringing in the occasional aging superstar has no real value is extreme. If they come in taking MLS seriously they can set a new standard of excellence for the younger guys to aspire to, in addition to doing things other guys just can't - see: TH14's volley that turned a "that's so metro" decision day fail into our first shield. I'd love an Henry on this team, who knows what it takes to win big and reach new levels, and with some magic in the boots to make something happen when nothing is happening (like Etienne winning us our 3rd shield with an individual effort, but more consistent). Imagine if MLS didn't fuck Metro from getting David Villa, and tell me the last few years don't include a cup or three.

#18
N8ballz

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I think you are missing my point. I said they have tried everything and nothing has worked ie signing Henry and Cahill and for the last few years, a couple of low profile DPs, homegrowns, internal talent development and a system but still no cups.

Nothing has worked so far. We aren't going to see a Cahill or Henry like signing any time soon unless the league really takes off and becomes on par with the big four in our country.  But a Kaku signing will happen here and there and more than that homegrown and diamonds in the rough like Long taxi and other concacaf level talent will be found and developed.  

Maybe it's the idea of what we think a DP is. BWP is a DP and a legend for us but he's no Henry or Ibrahimovic.  He's an excellent player for MLS, a DP but not someone who necessarily we will sell on to another league.  He's found his level, value and acceptance here in MLS. Kind of like an average MLB player who goes to Japan and excels.

What I'm trying to say is we are going to have to ride this out and be even more patient as Red Bull follows their plan.  There no quick fixes any more, meaning big name DPs but there will be younger low level DPs but more than that concacaf level developed talent.  It's a longview for us, a suffering fan base to have to wait for but it is what it is.

And Olsen didn't turn DC into a bunch of whining, diving.. oh, nevermind

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#19
uptownbull

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"nothing works" is reductive. 3 shields indicate that a lot of things are working.

The problem with the Henry era was it took Roxburgh too long to build a good team around him. Team has only very recently gotten a clue about building strong rosters.

Things are working. Now RB just has to be bold and combine the best of the current and prior eras. This team plus an Henry is a nightmare to stop.





#20
Voice of Reason II

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"nothing works" is reductive. 3 shields indicate that a lot of things are working.

The problem with the Henry era was it took Roxburgh too long to build a good team around him. Team has only very recently gotten a clue about building strong rosters.

Things are working. Now RB just has to be bold and combine the best of the current and prior eras. This team plus an Henry is a nightmare to stop.


 

Henry didn't have the work rate by the time he got to us to fit our current system, at least not for 4 years, but I agree with your general point. Someone of Henry's capabilities with legs would do the trick (I don't mean an exact clone, Henry was rare, I just mean at an upper echelon player). A Robben type winger/striker would be killer for a team like ours. 

 

Royer is good, but he can't put the ball onto his left foot and make a good cross. His big move is to cut across the top of the box. When Lawrence is playing he adds that threat, but when it is Lade there in his place is no attack out wide on the left at all. Muyl can cross, but sadly his shot is lacking. Maybe he will finally bust that mental block, but  he will never become a slick dribbler where defenders have to really hold back.

 

So either find a really good winger or a top flight 10 and move Kaku out wider.

 

Damn, we are so close I can taste it. We have pretty good depth, just lacking that extra bit of ball skill to balance out the attack. While Rzat doesn't cover quite as much defensive ground as Adams (who does?), he does improve our midfield shooting at least.



#21
RedBullScouse

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Henry didn't have the work rate by the time he got to us to fit our current system, at least not for 4 years, but I agree with your general point. Someone of Henry's capabilities with legs would do the trick (I don't mean an exact clone, Henry was rare, I just mean at an upper echelon player). A Robben type winger/striker would be killer for a team like ours. 

 

Royer is good, but he can't put the ball onto his left foot and make a good cross. His big move is to cut across the top of the box. When Lawrence is playing he adds that threat, but when it is Lade there in his place is no attack out wide on the left at all. Muyl can cross, but sadly his shot is lacking. Maybe he will finally bust that mental block, but  he will never become a slick dribbler where defenders have to really hold back.

 

So either find a really good winger or a top flight 10 and move Kaku out wider.

 

Damn, we are so close I can taste it. We have pretty good depth, just lacking that extra bit of ball skill to balance out the attack. While Rzat doesn't cover quite as much defensive ground as Adams (who does?), he does improve our midfield shooting at least.

Its all so absurdly obvious, I would love to get Armas off the record with a few beers and hear him explain how it could  be seen any other way.   This team is often compared to Liverpool... the lack of cups, the style of play, the budget, not ownerships priority....   but when Klopp proved what he could do, they finally opened up the purse strings to give him the missing pieces needed at CB and in goal.  You have to think the Armas/Marsch group has proven their ability to make the most out of what they are given, and have earned that last bit of investment needed to finally get it done.


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#22
Voice of Reason II

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Its all so absurdly obvious, I would love to get Armas off the record with a few beers and hear him explain how it could  be seen any other way.   This team is often compared to Liverpool... the lack of cups, the style of play, the budget....   but when Klopp proved what he could do, they finally opened up the purse strings to give him the missing pieces needed at CB and in goal.  You have to think the Armas/Marsch group has proven their ability to make the most out of what they are given, and have earned that last bit of investment needed to finally get it done.

I'll join you and slip the truth serum into his glass..

 

But maybe we can't handle the truth  :D



#23
uptownbull

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Agree with all that, you definitely said it better - but of course I think the dude Derrick merits a mention before Muyl when we're talking about players who offer attacking dynamism. And while you're talking to Coach Chris put in a word about mixing up his motivational content a bit. Guys? Guys! Come on you guys.

 

Pushing Kaku wide is an easy fix, especially with the amount of CMs they seem to suddenly have. My ideal player for the CAM spot is like a Kevin Prince Boateng. Or a young SK16. Valot, Koffi, Casseres can offer a more physical, direct presence centrally?

 

----BWP-----

Royer--Kaku 

-----Valot----

-RZA-Davis-

 

Or the 4222?

-Royer-BWP-

Kaku-----DE7

-RZA-Davis-

92---------62

----33-26----

----Luis!-----

 

Man I can't wait for the season! Also, they must be pretty...high on Abang if they've put up with his rollercoaster this long.



#24
Eleazar

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I'm gonna guess the typical 18 when everyone is healthy:

 

BWP

Royer Kaku Valot

Rza Davis

Taxi Long Parker Murillo

Robles

 

Meara Tarek Duncan/Lade Muyl Etienne Casseres White

 

In league play, this 18 should do pretty well. 


RIP Guillermo Romulo, Alexander Francis Orig and Celenio Eleazar.

 

RIP Cesar Castello, Mike Vallo, and Glenn Stampiglia

 

"Team That I Dream Of" and "Faithful To The Colors" 

 

 


#25
Voice of Reason II

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I'm gonna guess the typical 18 when everyone is healthy:

 

BWP

Royer Kaku Valot

Rza Davis

Taxi Long Parker Murillo

Robles

 

Meara Tarek Duncan/Lade Muyl Etienne Casseres White

 

In league play, this 18 should do pretty well. 

Same team minus Adams. They knew once Jesse left that they were losing Adams and they didn't replace him nor add the extra chess piece to get us over the top? Sigh...I know,  :deadhorse:  material, but it just blows my mind. Yes, we will win games and make the playoffs, but I see no difference maker.



#26
uptownbull

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They're also trying to sign another European CM, right? Gotta think Kaku goes wide more often if they do.

#27
Father Ted

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Unless you're a top 10 superclub in Europe, technically every other team is a feeder club.  Atlanta selling Almiron to the mighty Newcastle united makes them a feeder club. Dortmund selling Keita to Liverpool makes them a feeder club.  Liverpool selling Suarez to Barcelona makes them a feeder club and so on.  That's the nature of the game.



#28
NittanyMetros

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Atlanta just made $15 million on their Almiron transfer.  They used that to pay for Pity Martinez and have a cup for it.  I think if we're gonna buy DP's and do the sell-on route, that's the way to go.   Find the guys who you can sell-on for big money and then move them to fund your next mid/high level transfer.

 

Unfortunately, we sold Tyler for $3m and a promise.  Nice if you're Leipzig, not so if you're Metro and trying to finance new players.

 

Seems to me Atlanta has figured out the new formula.  Be the pit-stop between South America and Europe for high quality and future higher prcied players and turn them at a profit to keep that running.  It's aggressive and smart. 


#RedBullOut


#29
Metrohoboken

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Atlanta just made $15 million on their Almiron transfer.  They used that to pay for Pity Martinez and have a cup for it.  I think if we're gonna buy DP's and do the sell-on route, that's the way to go.   Find the guys who you can sell-on for big money and then move them to fund your next mid/high level transfer.

 

Unfortunately, we sold Tyler for $3m and a promise.  Nice if you're Leipzig, not so if you're Metro and trying to finance new players.

 

Seems to me Atlanta has figured out the new formula.  Be the pit-stop between South America and Europe for high quality and future higher prcied players and turn them at a profit to keep that running.  It's aggressive and smart. 

Agree NYRB needs to step it up in the new buy and flip market that ATL is setting the standard.  

 

Tyler pathway is the promise realized.  Same for Long Davis etc.

 

Same team minus Adams. They knew once Jesse left that they were losing Adams and they didn't replace him nor add the extra chess piece to get us over the top? Sigh...I know,  :deadhorse:  material, but it just blows my mind. Yes, we will win games and make the playoffs, but I see no difference maker.

agree we need a high level winger but I am ok adding now or in the summer.  I realize the fear is we will see a repeat of the last few years where we are great in the league and miss that 1 player/combo for the knock outs. 

 

Adams is replaced by RZA with Casseres as understudy. 


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#30
Komba

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Spending goes both ways.  Atlanta did well with Almiron because he's a great player but they'll lose plenty of money on Barco.

 

I'd prefer the team spent more but it is what it is.  More curious to see how Armas does.  Last season was a continuation of Marsch.  Now players will test Armas.  He has to be able to deal with that and get them to buy in as much as they did before.  This is entirely his team now.  Hoping for the best but it's hard to find 2 really good coaches in a row.






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