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If Kljestan sits, who starts?


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#106
iced1776

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I think Etienne is a non-issue. He doesnt seem like hes Marschs type of player. But, if they wanted to move on from Sacha and give Adams or Davis a shot at that role, thats not tanking or throwing away a season. Would you expect to win MLS Cup? No, to be fair though, I dont know who they would bring in that would make me feel that way.

TFC brought in the best player in MLS plus two high earning DPs and it still took them 3 years to be dominate in th regular season.

 

I'm not seeing how TFC continuing to improve as they sign high quality players (like Vasquez this year) supports Red Bulls being OK by continuing to not sign high quality players, especially when we're literally seeing our results decline alongside our ambition in the transfer window.

 

I guess I'm nuts here but I can't believe how casually you guys think we can replace a guy who has been top of the MLS assist charts over the last three seasons and still compete at a similar level. Whether its Felipe, Davis, Adams, Etienne, or anyone else on the current roster, all of those guys would have to make a huge jump to carry the entire team's attack like Kljestan has. I don't buy the argument that more energetic pressing makes up for the only creative passer on the team either.

 

This just sounds like complacency and overconfidence to me.



#107
elf

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You think Felipe would lead the league in assists? 


In an advance midfield role, felipe got 10 assists when he played for a terrible montreal team. Di vao had a bad season that year with 5 goals and the next best offensive weapon was nyassi.

#108
McSoccer

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I'm not seeing how TFC continuing to improve as they sign high quality players (like Vasquez this year) supports Red Bulls being OK by continuing to not sign high quality players, especially when we're literally seeing our results decline alongside our ambition in the transfer window.
 
I guess I'm nuts here but I can't believe how casually you guys think we can replace a guy who has been top of the MLS assist charts over the last three seasons and still compete at a similar level. Whether its Felipe, Davis, Adams, Etienne, or anyone else on the current roster, all of those guys would have to make a huge jump to carry the entire team's attack like Kljestan has. I don't buy the argument that more energetic pressing makes up for the only creative passer on the team either.
 
This just sounds like complacency and overconfidence to me.

My point is it still took TFC three years after signing the best player in the league to be the best team in the league.

Im saying Id give guys like Davis and Adams and Etienne can get to the level of Jozy, Bradley, & Vazquez (not Giovinco). It may just take a year or two.

#109
McSoccer

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You think Felipe would lead the league in assists? 

Can we stop with this argument? Lead the league with 17 assists (3 GWA), but only had TWO goals. Vazquez had one less assist (6 GWA), but 8 goals. Nguyen two less assists (3 GWA), but 11 goals. Higuain (5 GWA) and Almiron (4 GWA), both had 14 assists and 9 goals.

Of the top five in assists, Sacha had the worst season.

#110
RedBullScouse

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...

 

I guess I'm nuts here but I can't believe how casually you guys think we can replace a guy who has been top of the MLS assist charts over the last three seasons and still compete at a similar level. ...

 

This just sounds like complacency and overconfidence to me.

It's like when Henry left.     No one expected Sasha to come in and match his assists, but he did, and nearly matched him in goals (shame how he barely has as many shots on goals today as he had goals then).   Or you change the system and spread it around so you aren;t as dependant on any one position.    That said, we need to spend money and bring in better talent like the rest of the league is doing.  


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#111
iced1776

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My point is it still took TFC three years after signing the best player in the league to be the best team in the league.

Im saying Id give guys like Davis and Adams and Etienne can get to the level of Jozy, Bradley, & Vazquez (not Giovinco). It may just take a year or two.

 

C'mon now...

 

It's like when Henry left.     No one expected Sasha to come in and match his assists, but he did, and nearly matched him in goals.     Or you change the system and spread it around so you aren;t as dependant on any one position.    That said, we need to spend money and bring in better talent like the rest of the league is doing.  

 

He's obviously never been Thierry Henry but Kljestan was a USMNT player with almost 50 caps, in his prime, coming off of half a decade of decent European experience. That resume is leaps and bounds above any of the other guys we're talking about replacing him. Still strikes me as overconfidence to put this and future seasons on any of their shoulders. Especially when the most likely of the group, Adams, is almost certainly gone after 2018.

 

Like you mentioned, its time to spend at least a tiny bit of money on the top end of the roster again.



#112
RedBullScouse

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C'mon now...

 

 

He's obviously never been Thierry Henry but Kljestan was a USMNT player with almost 50 caps, in his prime, coming off of half a decade of decent European experience. That resume is leaps and bounds above any of the other guys we're talking about replacing him. Still strikes me as overconfidence to put this and future seasons on any of their shoulders. Especially when the most likely of the group, Adams, is almost certainly gone after 2018.

 

Like you mentioned, its time to spend at least a tiny bit of money on the top end of the roster again.

At the same age, Adams is way ahead of Sacha in terms of professional experience AND ceiling.    Sacha was still a couple years away from his first USMNT cap.   

 

That said, Etienne will never be Jozy, and Adams (who I very much like) is a considerable stretch to project as every being a Bradley, especially given his age.


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#113
McSoccer

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It's like when Henry left.     No one expected Sasha to come in and match his assists, but he did, and nearly matched him in goals.     Or you change the system and spread it around so you aren;t as dependant on any one position.    That said, we need to spend money and bring in better talent like the rest of the league is doing.  

First, Adams has the potential to be the best of any player on that list. Second, Etienne has potential to be a 10-25 goal scorer in this league. And, Im not saying Vazquez in his prime. I think Davis, in a CAM could get double digit assists and 5-6 goals from the run of play.

We just diasgree Im how to build a team.

#114
RedBullScouse

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First, Adams has the potential to be the best of any player on that list. Second, Etienne has potential to be a 10-25 goal scorer in this league. And, I'm not saying Vazquez in his prime. I think Davis, in a CAM could get double digit assists and 5-6 goals from the run of play.

We just diasgree Im how to build a team.

Adams, yes.  Davis, yes. 

 

Etienne?  I just don't see it, except maybe at the bottom end of that range.   I don't know who he'd take minutes from to develop into something more at the first team level.


"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth." - Iron Mike

 

Bitch covered my plaid?
The sorrow inside me grows.
I need my plaid pitch.

"It goes without saying that when things don't go your way they just don't go your way. " - JCO

"He can't kick with his left foot, he can't tackle, he can't head the ball and he doesn't score many goals. Apart from that, he's all right.”
George Best, on David Beckham


#115
Paul Nasta

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Just in terms of Adams v. Bradley, I'd take Tyler right now.  Covers more ground and is a better tackler.  About the same as a passer.  Maybe Bradley has a better shot, but goalscoring is not a big part of either player's game (yet).  And Adams is getting better while Bradley is not.

 

20/20 hindsight, but I sure would have preferred Adams over Bradley against T&T.



#116
McSoccer

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Adams, yes.  Davis, yes. 
 
Etienne?  I just don't see it, except maybe at the bottom end of that range.   I don't know who he'd take minutes from to develop into something more at the first team level.

Fair enough. I wouldnt bet the house on Etienne, but hes scored some nice goals with RB2 (including some decent free kicks) and I think that translates to MLS on some level. Hes a different than Allen because Etienne can actually run a little.

#117
McSoccer

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Was really hoping we could trade Sacha to LAFC during this window.

And totally, as MF said above, there was no way we could get Zimmerman because that top spot is definitely a big piece of that trade.

I get LAFC would be a place Sacha is interested in, but why would they be interested in him?

#118
iced1776

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I get LAFC would be a place Sacha is interested in, but why would they be interested in him?

 

I mean yeah he looked a step slower this year but the dude just topped the assist charts for 2017...



#119
Arsenal14

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I mean yeah he looked a step slower this year but the dude just topped the assist charts for 2017...

Also dominated the analytics game.  11.33 expected assists (primary assists only), which led the league, and was nearly 3 xA above third place.  3.89 key passes per game, which led the league among regular players (no one ahead of him played more than 200 minutes all season).  

 

http://www.americans...player-xg-2017/

 

Kljestan was frustrating as hell at times this year, but his production was really good in the end.



#120
iced1776

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Also dominated the analytics game.  11.33 expected assists (primary assists only), which led the league, and was nearly 3 xA above third place.  3.89 key passes per game, which led the league among regular players (no one ahead of him played more than 200 minutes all season).  

 

http://www.americans...player-xg-2017/

 

Kljestan was frustrating as hell at times this year, but his production was really good in the end.

 

Its really mind-boggling isn't it? I'm not sure I've ever seen a player produce so much while so regularly failing the "eye test". There were games this year where I thought he was awful, but watching replays he could have had half a dozen assists.






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