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Some people defend Struber and Thelwell


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#16
RedBullScouse

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While Struber is certainly making a compelling case to equal or surpass Armas' incompetence though may not be there yet (though quickly getting there), so far Thellwell has done even worse than Hamlett. At least with Hamlett we always seemed to have that #10 spot after Henry left with Sacha and Kaku. Got guys like Royer and Sims too, who were productive in final 3d. Jesse gets credit for that too, but still. It almost seems like Kevin's motto to Denis is that anything you can do, I can do worse. Hamlet screwed up with Jorgey's 2.5 mil waste, so Kevin doubles that up with Klimala.

 

So far, it looks like this to me: Thelwell < Hamlett < lamppost.

Hamlet and Armas both road Jesse's coattails.    Sacha was a Jesse move.    Kaku had mixed reviews, at best...  which is not to say we wouldn't be better off with him right now.

Klimala hasn't been great, or even particularly good, but he's no Matty Ice.    Harper seems to be the closer comparison, but we didn't spend $2M+ on Harper.  Gutman and Edwards are strong additions.    Reyes and Fabio may still prove to be.    The bar is very, very low.    


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#17
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It's a poor argument. Carlos Quieroz, Carlos Alberto Parreira, Bora Militunovic, Bob Bradley, Bruce Arena, Juan Carlos Osorio, etc... all had teams after them when we all agreed it was time for a change here. They all ended up doing just fine. Doesn't mean they were a good fit for our team at the time.


Well, Bradley and Arena should have stayed. Two of the dumbest moves in team history.

 

Osorio is a perfect example. He has pretty good success since leaving MLS. (Except in managing his wife and girlfriend.) He was an absolute disaster here, 2008 playoff run be damned. (Thank Dane Richards and the goalpost.)


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#18
NittanyMetros

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I dont mind going to bat for Struber, but I really think his track record lately hasn't been great. There were warning signs with Barnsley and their surge up the table last year and we're struggling ourselves now.

Our roster is not of MLS standard at several key position groups...striker the most obvious one.

But struber also has some answering to do for the blown leads we've had this season.

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#19
iced1776

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Looking back at signings that happened under Hamlett as Sporting Director, he actually didn't start out all that badly. 2017 and 2018 were pretty active off seasons and he managed to bring in guys, even project players, who ended up making a significant impact on the team. 2019 (first season without Marsch) was when things came to a grinding halt. He signed half as many players that year compared to previous seasons and the few he did sign haven't done much to date.

 

Notable signings under Hamlett:

2017 - Murillo, Long

2018 - Kaku, Parker, Duncan, Casseres, Rzatkowski

2019 - Jorgensen, Sims

2020 - Yearwood, Clark

 

Thelwell I think has done OK on the "project player" signings. I can see guys like Fabio, Edwards, Reyes, Gutman, and Coronel sticking around for a few years and contributing. But if Klimala continues to bomb, or worse yet Thelwell whiffs as badly on his next big signing, then it won't really matter much. I'm still skeptical you can with in MLS these days with just project players.



#20
RedBullScouse

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Looking back at signings that happened under Hamlett as Sporting Director, he actually didn't start out all that badly. 2017 and 2018 were pretty active off seasons and he managed to bring in guys, even project players, who ended up making a significant impact on the team. 2019 (first season without Marsch) was when things came to a grinding halt. He signed half as many players that year compared to previous seasons and the few he did sign haven't done much to date.

 

Notable signings under Hamlett:

2017 - Murillo, Long

2018 - Kaku, Parker, Duncan, Casseres, Rzatkowski

2019 - Jorgensen, Sims

2020 - Yearwood, Clark

 

Thelwell I think has done OK on the "project player" signings. I can see guys like Fabio, Edwards, Reyes, Gutman, and Coronel sticking around for a few years and contributing. But if Klimala continues to bomb, or worse yet Thelwell whiffs as badly on his next big signing, then it won't really matter much. I'm still skeptical you can with in MLS these days with just project players.

His next big signing will be his first big signing, xfer fees aside.


"Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth." - Iron Mike

 

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"It goes without saying that when things don't go your way they just don't go your way. " - JCO

"He can't kick with his left foot, he can't tackle, he can't head the ball and he doesn't score many goals. Apart from that, he's all right.”
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#21
Koko

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Looking back at signings that happened under Hamlett as Sporting Director, he actually didn't start out all that badly. 2017 and 2018 were pretty active off seasons and he managed to bring in guys, even project players, who ended up making a significant impact on the team. 2019 (first season without Marsch) was when things came to a grinding halt. He signed half as many players that year compared to previous seasons and the few he did sign haven't done much to date.
 
Notable signings under Hamlett:
2017 - Murillo, Long
2018 - Kaku, Parker, Duncan, Casseres, Rzatkowski
2019 - Jorgensen, Sims
2020 - Yearwood, Clark
 
Thelwell I think has done OK on the "project player" signings. I can see guys like Fabio, Edwards, Reyes, Gutman, and Coronel sticking around for a few years and contributing. But if Klimala continues to bomb, or worse yet Thelwell whiffs as badly on his next big signing, then it won't really matter much. I'm still skeptical you can with in MLS these days with just project players.


Which leads me to believe Marsch made those signings happen.

#22
McSoccer

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I dont mind going to bat for Struber, but I really think his track record lately hasn't been great. But struber also has some answering to do for the blown leads we've had this season.

Agreed. Blown leads and maybe sticking to dual forward formations. I understand his thinking, with the high press, two up front puts more pressure on the opposing defense, but its not working. Marsch tried two forwards a lot and always end up with BWP playing solo, because he performed so much better that way.

This team is only going to be good if Klimala can get going. Why not try him up too by himself? Im not saying it will work, but better strikers than Klimala have struggled playing with a strike partner and excelled alone.

#23
McSoccer

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Which leads me to believe Marsch made those signings happen.

Yea, impossible to separate anything Hamlett did from Marsch while Marsch was the coach. Especially since EVERYTHING went downhill after Marsch left.

#24
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You can't give Hamlett credit for Long, he played for the first team in 2016 in CONCACAF games.


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#25
Antonius Block

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I just do not see what evidence there is that Struber is a good coach. He has not been took successful at any first team he has coached and I have not seen him do anything here that made be believe he is either particularly good tactically or developmentally.  


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#26
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I just do not see what evidence there is that Struber is a good coach. He has not been took successful at any first team he has coached and I have not seen him do anything here that made be believe he is either particularly good tactically or developmentally.  

I liked the Struber pick up (as, at the time, I felt it signaled a commitment from RB global), but I agree. He seems tactically rigid and I am not a fan of coaches who only talk "heart" and "focus" .... 

 

Add some wins in, and I could feel different, but the proof is in the pudding. I dont see enough tactical understanding of teammates positioning in the final third. It would be nice if they could both create chaos with the press, then have some organized runs/passing sequences once they win the ball.   



#27
Metrohoboken

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Berhalter may be available in a month.  He is a successful MLS coach...........

 

just kidding - I think he is good coach (not amazing) and hope that does not come to pass because it means more USMNT ties or losses)


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#28
iced1776

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I just do not see what evidence there is that Struber is a good coach. He has not been took successful at any first team he has coached and I have not seen him do anything here that made be believe he is either particularly good tactically or developmentally.  

 

Keeping our defensive record as good as it is through the injury crisis should be considered a modern day miracle. And through that stretch most goals conceded were the result of clear individual errors rather than an unorganized team. He's bought a far longer leash from me for that alone. His views on attacking play do seem outdated by a few decades and he's yet to adjust anything, so I'm not fully bought in for that reason.

 

Developmentally, Davis and Nealis are having career years. CCJ was as well before getting burned out by Copa America. Clark was coming along great before the appendectomy. I don't think anyone necessarily looks worse than they did last year either.

 

It's a toss up right now, criticism is totally fair but personally I'm not ready to put him on the chopping block yet. I'd like to see what his team looks like with some more raw attacking talent, if we can trust Thelwell to provide that.



#29
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Keeping our defensive record as good as it is through the injury crisis should be considered a modern day miracle. And through that stretch most goals conceded were the result of clear individual errors rather than an unorganized team. He's bought a far longer leash from me for that alone. His views on attacking play do seem outdated by a few decades and he's yet to adjust anything, so I'm not fully bought in for that reason.
 
Developmentally, Davis and Nealis are having career years. CCJ was as well before getting burned out by Copa America. Clark was coming along great before the appendectomy. I don't think anyone necessarily looks worse than they did last year either.
 
It's a toss up right now, criticism is totally fair but personally I'm not ready to put him on the chopping block yet. I'd like to see what his team looks like with some more raw attacking talent, if we can trust Thelwell to provide that.


You bring up a number of good points. The offense problem is massive though, but I can give him a very minor pass as this was a huge problem last year as well. The issues this season are far more about roster construction than Strubers job.

#30
TK_RBNY

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Lets take a look at the important sporting hierarchy with RBNY

Thelwell, Struber, and Mccafferty (obviously) all have a background in academy/player development, that seems to be by design based on the type of roster and signings made over the recent period.

As long as RBNY do a better job of development within their own academy Mccaffertys job is safe. He is fulfilling the #1 priority of the global philosophy.

If Struber has to be the scapegoat for poor results on the field/poor quality in the team or deservingly gets sacked on his own accord, theyll just replace him with another coach with a similar background.

Thelwell probably gets to make one more coaching change before he potentially faces the axe. However, if he is being constrained by global or doing exactly what his bosses are laying out for him its possible it doesnt matter how good or bad NY does under his guidance and a promotion is in the cards.






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