512 replies to this topic

[MiLo4891]

Having self imposed budgetary constraints, while not doing the one thing that could increase your budget (player sales) is not an identity. Its self flagellation. Whats the purpose? 

I concur... It's spinning their ineptitude.

[MiLo4891]

1:12 Mateschitz was actually in Hoboken?

Those are really good odds....


Considering he died 4 months ago

[JBigjake54]

Those are really good odds....
Considering he died 4 months ago

The alleged visit occurred in 2006.

[ESCfanatic279]

I hope this club completely fails this season. Maybe everybody including DeGrandpre will be fired. Maybe Red Bull sees this failure and decides to sell the team to ownership who cares.

[MTF]

Red Bull may not care about winning an MLS Cup (and sure enough, they haven't), but if their primary goal is what so many say it is, developing talent to sell to Europe, they have a very poor track record of that too. Successes: Ream (drafted and developed by Clever Hans), Adams (academy product), and Miazga (academy...and he's already washed out of Europe and is back in MLS). Not so successful: Clark wasn't developed here...we'll see. Duncan failed in Europe. Lawrence developed while here...washed out of Europe. Long, one of the best we've developed, never made it to Europe for a myriad of reasons. Kaku, skipped town. So what is Red Bull Global getting out of this? The only thing I see is marketing for the beverage division and the rising tide of MLS franchise valuations. They are losing money on an operating basis. Why not sell the franchise to someone interested in running it? Cash out. Maintain a beneficial contractual relationship with the new ownership group...Red Bull remains as arena sponsor and primary shirt sponsor...there's your beverage marketing. Put in place a scouting relationship between the new owners and Red Bull...there's your development pipeline. I see ways for Red Bull to get the same benefits out of MLS that they currently are without their current disadvantages of having to be a franchisee. Running this huge operation and playing in front of an empty stadium in the New York Metropolitan area seems like very bad business to me. 

[MuylStan]

Ride what out? The complete emptying of Red Bull Arena? The NYCFC match is meaningless. The teams are headed in opposite directions. Give Troy a good 25 match run to see if he's got major league coaching chops.

I can't read their minds but I think the powers that be don't really care about fanbase sentiment and just look at xG and such. Not crazy to think they may just say "oh we'll be fine once we get luqi and morgan back". i think it's more likely they sacrifice struber after they lose the derby to look like they're "doing something" though
 

We are in the top third of the league for defense. We've never given up more than 2 goals.

This was the first time this year we gave up 2...

[MTF]

I can't read their minds but I think the powers that be don't really care about fanbase sentiment and just look at xG and such. Not crazy to think they may just say "oh we'll be fine once we get luqi and morgan back". i think it's more likely they sacrifice struber after they lose the derby to look like they're "doing something" though
 

They may not care (I mean, they've all but come out and said it with their actions), but the reality is they are owner / operators (not club owners) in a single entity league. All of the investors have to pull their weight. This is the New York Metropolitan market. Red Bull may not care if their New York operation becomes Chivas USA 2.0 and has 6,000 people in their 25,000 seat arena, but SOMEONE (Garber, the other investors, Apple) will care...very soon, if not already, and very much. It may take some time, but Red Bull cannot be seen as doing nothing to reconnect with the fanbase and getting people in the building. Training facilities, infrastructure investment are great, but the league is in the entertainment business (ever more important with the risk involved in this Apple partnership). This franchise has begun a death spiral.

[MuylStan]

They may not care (I mean, they've all but come out and said it with their actions), but the reality is they are owner / operators (not club owners) in a single entity league. All of the investors have to pull their weight. This is the New York Metropolitan market. Red Bull may not care if their New York operation becomes Chivas USA 2.0 and has 6,000 people in their 25,000 seat arena, but SOMEONE (Garber, the other investors, Apple) will care...very soon, if not already, and very much. It may take some time, but Red Bull cannot be seen as doing nothing to reconnect with the fanbase and getting people in the building. Training facilities, infrastructure investment are great, but the league is in the entertainment business (ever more important with the risk involved in this Apple partnership). This franchise has begun a death spiral.

We are the cockroaches of MLS supporters... there is basically no reason to keep supporting this club when NYCFC is a much better operation, most of us still do it because we're not quitters.

[MetroFanatic]

We are the cockroaches of MLS supporters... there is basically no reason to keep supporting this club when NYCFC is a much better operation, most of us still do it because we're not quitters.

I wouldn't call anyone owned by slavers a "better organization". Not like our owner is anything to write home about.

[MuylStan]

I wouldn't call anyone owned by slavers a "better organization". Not like our owner is anything to write home about.

Yeah you're right that they have their issues (understatement), but ultimately I think the whole thing has a much better marketing pitch than RBNY... and they've actually been very successful in the last 5 years on the pitch. We have our issues too (front and center recently). 

After COVID with the team not sniffing any real reason to have title optimism, they have shed STHs and failed to make the arena look more than half full... the ones that are still around, I don't know if they have it in them to quit, given how much reason they've already been given to do it

[ivo]

They may not care (I mean, they've all but come out and said it with their actions), but the reality is they are owner / operators (not club owners) in a single entity league. All of the investors have to pull their weight. This is the New York Metropolitan market. Red Bull may not care if their New York operation becomes Chivas USA 2.0 and has 6,000 people in their 25,000 seat arena, but SOMEONE (Garber, the other investors, Apple) will care...very soon, if not already, and very much. It may take some time, but Red Bull cannot be seen as doing nothing to reconnect with the fanbase and getting people in the building. Training facilities, infrastructure investment are great, but the league is in the entertainment business (ever more important with the risk involved in this Apple partnership). This franchise has begun a death spiral.

Sorry, but this is just wishful thinking. No way the league forces Red Bull out. They are currently spending 5M a year on DPs for the last 3 seasons, putting serious money in facilities, and haven't missed the playoffs in a decade and a half (still might not this year - we'll see). No other owner would sign on to setting a precedent like that.

[MTF]

Sorry, but this is just wishful thinking. No way the league forces Red Bull out. They are currently spending 5M a year on DPs for the last 3 seasons, putting serious money in facilities, and haven't missed the playoffs in a decade and a half (still might not this year - we'll see). No other owner would sign on to setting a precedent like that.

Here's what I said: "Red Bull may not care if their New York operation becomes Chivas USA 2.0 and has 6,000 people in their 25,000 seat arena, but SOMEONE (Garber, the other investors, Apple) will care...very soon, if not already, and very much. It may take some time, but Red Bull cannot be seen as doing nothing to reconnect with the fanbase and getting people in the building. Training facilities, infrastructure investment are great, but the league is in the entertainment business (ever more important with the risk involved in this Apple partnership). This franchise has begun a death spiral." 

 

I never said anything about the league forcing a sale...but I can see the league / owners holding an intervention. The team is certainly in a death spiral with its fanbase. The league cannot afford to have one of their two biggest media markets be a complete failure (and I call Red Bulls' attendance and media penetration an utter failure). Red Bull needs to do something...they cannot continue business as usual and expect fans, especially casuals, to get excited about a larger training facility. Would I like to see RBG decide after 17 years that now is a good time to cash out? Absolutely. That's my wishful thinking perhaps.

 

MLS and Red Bull should approach this as a business case. For example, fire De Grandpre and much of the front office and bring in experienced American sports executives. Cut ties between NY and Red Bull Soccer Global (or at least that perception) and let NY stand on its own. Rebrand...we've seen that often enough in MLS...Metro SC, Metropolitan SC, or RB Metro sponsored by Red Bull. Put us back in red, black, and gold. Something to connect with current and former supporters. Something.

[SatansHockey]

Terrible record.

Awful soccer.

Shit players.

Pathetic attendance.

Fans not united.

Burn the whole fucking thing to the ground.

[Arsenal14]

The league cannot afford to have one of their two biggest media markets be a complete failure

Why?

This team has cycled through periods of excitement and irrelevance before, and MLS is still standing.

Besides, if we're talking about big media markets failing, Chicago's overall incompetence is much worse, and the Galaxy's sudden fanbase collapse is a bigger active crisis.

[MTF]

Why?

This team has cycled through periods of excitement and irrelevance before, and MLS is still standing.

Besides, if we're talking about big media markets failing, Chicago's overall incompetence is much worse, and the Galaxy's sudden fanbase collapse is a bigger active crisis.

Why? Because MLS is in the subscription business and the NY Metropolitan area is ~20 million people, or almost 1/5 of the USA. They are a for-profit business and failure to maximize revenues from their largest markets, NY, LA, Philly, Dallas, Atlanta, Houston, and yes, #3 Chicago, holds the league back or, at worst, can mean the death knell if Apple does in fact have the ability to pull the plug written into the contract. If folks in this area don't connect with one of the metro teams it's highly unlikely they'll be at all interested in spending money to purchase MLS Season Pass. The league wanted rivalries in LA and NY, primarily to help it in getting future broadcasting deals. I'm sure MLS brass and fellow owners are very concerned about the Red Bull, Galaxy, and Chicago situations.