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Juventus to poach Clark?


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#31
CGF

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I think it's a good bet that, if we weren't going to sell him to Leipzig, he wasn't going to sign with us.

 

That being said, with Adams and Clark saving them probably tens of millions in transfer fees at this point they better fucking invest in our club and help us pull in some DPs. 

At the very least give us loanees that are better than Rzatkowski and Sekagya


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#32
defendyourself

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From the perspective of RB corporate, who are ultimately funding all the teams, it really doesn't make a difference.  A penny saved is a penny earned.  If they get Clark at a discount, they have saved some amount of money that it would cost to buy a similar player and thus have it available to spend on something else.  The issue is that it will likely not be spending in New York. 

 

My biggest issue with these future transfer decisions is that that are completely removed from decisions based on the competitiveness at the team at the time the transfer takes place. The Adams deal was similarly structured and I believe that if we had been able to keep him for another year, the team would have been a serious MLS Cup threat.  Instead it fell apart because Adams was the most important player in the team.

 

If Clark breaks out this year and the team looks good, the team will immediately be be broken up like it was when Adams left. Jordan Morris has shown the value of top level American prospect who is willing to play for multiple years in building an MLS Cup winner.  With the RB policy, it seems unlikely we will ever be able to build a core of players that will be able to compete for years.  Teams that win titles do not regularly get rid of their best young talent when on the cusp of winning things. 


as long as key players dont leave in the middle of the season i think a good general manager should be able to keep the team cup contenders even as some of the young players turnover.  Our issue wasnt Tyler leaving it was that they completely misread what was needed to replace him.  Enough of the core (the whole back 5, Kaku) was kept that we should have been fine.  If they signed Van Der Bruggen or someone like that i dont know if we would be having the same conversations.



#33
JBigjake54

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What transfer fee?


Just before it hits the firewall, the article says that a transfer fee is to be agreed upon, in the $2-3M range.

We are good enough to beat the best teams, and bad enough to lose to the worst teams. 


#34
Antonius Block

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Replacing your best players, especially young ones who are rapidly improving like Adams and hopefully Clark, is incredibly difficult.  Even if we had a great GM, to replace a talent like Adams with a player who can step in at the exact same level, you would need to pay an established at least as much as Adams was sold for, which defeats the point of selling Adams.  There was not a defensive midfielder in MLS nearly as good as 2019 Tyler Adams.  To get such a player would have cost a ton of money.   

 

Keeping good young players who can become stars is how you build winners.  Selling them is how you get bags of money.  And as the great Johan Cruyff said "I've never seen a bag of money score a goal."  

 

If Clark begins to show that he is a real star on the level of Adams or even Aaronson, getting rid of him at the end of the season will be bad for the team.  Maybe you can replace him but a bird in hand is worth two in the bush. 


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#35
rhactl7

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Its a complicated situation. You could say the $2-3M fee is low...but on the other hand, this is a player that we basically just signed a short time ago. And he ONLY signed with us because of our connection/ability to sell him to Europe. So given the context, it sounds like a pretty good deal. We should hope the deal has a large sell on fee like Adams deal does. 

 

I think we will have to wait and see how this Red Bull strategy plays out. Red Bull is slowly earning a VERY good reputation (both in US and and Europe) as a top academy and place for top young players. New York should be even more appealing to top American talent because of the direct pipeline options to Europe. 

 

Obviously, the difference between Leipzig/Salzburg and New York is that those teams have re-invested the money into their teams and are top spenders/competitors in their own league. Is that going to happen here too? We will see....



#36
Efried

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Replacing your best players, especially young ones who are rapidly improving like Adams and hopefully Clark, is incredibly difficult.  Even if we had a great GM, to replace a talent like Adams with a player who can step in at the exact same level, you would need to pay an established at least as much as Adams was sold for, which defeats the point of selling Adams.  There was not a defensive midfielder in MLS nearly as good as 2019 Tyler Adams.  To get such a player would have cost a ton of money.   
 
Keeping good young players who can become stars is how you build winners.  Selling them is how you get bags of money.  And as the great Johan Cruyff said "I've never seen a bag of money score a goal."  
 
If Clark begins to show that he is a real star on the level of Adams or even Aaronson, getting rid of him at the end of the season will be bad for the team.  Maybe you can replace him but a bird in hand is worth two in the bush. 

in MLS selling them is what you do we are a selling league. If you are keeping a young player its because they arent good enough to make the jump

#37
Antonius Block

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in MLS selling them is what you do we are a selling league. If you are keeping a young player its because they arent good enough to make the jump

You can be a selling league but not sell as soon as there is interest the player from Europe.  You can hold on to a player to try to win something, if that is what the team is primarily interested in.  RBNY is not primarily interested in winning.  They are primarily interested in developing players for Liepzig and Salzburg or for sale.

 

If RBNY's philosophy is to build a team of young players and then sell them as soon as they are ready to make the jump to Europe, the team will never be able to win in MLS because lots of teams have a core of players who are good enough to play in Europe but pay them to stay in MLS.  Lodeiro, Zelarayan, Morris, Nagbe, Ruidiaz, etc. all could play in Europe very easily but have spent some part of their prime years in MLS and that has led to winning teams.  

 

RBNY clearly is not interested in bringing in players in their prime of the quality of the ones I have listed.  The only way they will be able to win with a strategy of building a core young up and comers is to try to hold on to some of that talent long enough to build a cohesive unit that can compete for 2 or 3 seasons.  I am not saying you must try to prevent these guys from ever going to Europe but you certainly have to try to hold on to them until they are 21 or 22, instead of selling as soon as big clubs are interested or Liepzig wants them.

 

RBNY is likely not going to be a title contender next season, however, if Clark pans out like many people think he can, he could conceivably lead a title contender in 2022 or 2023 but due to the fact that RB corporate does not really care about building a title contender, he will not even get that chance. 

 

The bottomline is that RBNY's transfer policy very clearly is not primarily focused on building a winning team at the moment.  If they wanted to build a winner, they would not agree to part with one of their most exciting players a year in advance. They would wait and see.


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#38
Efried

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You can be a selling league but not sell as soon as there is interest the player from Europe.  You can hold on to a player to try to win something, if that is what the team is primarily interested in.  RBNY is not primarily interested in winning.  They are primarily interested in developing players for Liepzig and Salzburg or for sale.
 
If RBNY's philosophy is to build a team of young players and then sell them as soon as they are ready to make the jump to Europe, the team will never be able to win in MLS because lots of teams have a core of players who are good enough to play in Europe but pay them to stay in MLS.  Lodeiro, Zelarayan, Morris, Nagbe, Ruidiaz, etc. all could play in Europe very easily but have spent some part of their prime years in MLS and that has led to winning teams.  
 
RBNY clearly is not interested in bringing in players in their prime of the quality of the ones I have listed.  The only way they will be able to win with a strategy of building a core young up and comers is to try to hold on to some of that talent long enough to build a cohesive unit that can compete for 2 or 3 seasons.  I am not saying you must try to prevent these guys from ever going to Europe but you certainly have to try to hold on to them until they are 21 or 22, instead of selling as soon as big clubs are interested or Liepzig wants them.
 
RBNY is likely not going to be a title contender next season, however, if Clark pans out like many people think he can, he could conceivably lead a title contender in 2022 or 2023 but due to the fact that RB corporate does not really care about building a title contender, he will not even get that chance. 
 
The bottomline is that RBNY's transfer policy very clearly is not primarily focused on building a winning team at the moment.  If they wanted to build a winner, they would not agree to part with one of their most exciting players a year in advance. They would wait and see.

Clark was going to Europe at 18 with or with out rbny. Rbny transfer policy is getting a full season from him. Tyler we got multiple seasons from. Prospects like that are not long for mls and you get what you can from them. These are blue chip prospects the market right now for blue chip prospects is all about moving them to Europe ASAP

#39
defendyourself

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Clark is being compared to the wrong people in terms of how long he should stay.  Dallas and the smurfs got nothing for blue chip guys like McKinnie and Reyna.  Brendan Aaronson played with Philly for two years just like Tyler did for us. Clark situation is different because he was a blue chipper AND essentially a free agent.  He wasnt going to staying for more than 2 seasons in any scenario

 

Frankly we've done well in terms of how long blue chipper stay with us and making sure they dont leave in the middle of the season.  we just mess up the other parts of team building, like having a striker that can kick the ball in the corner.



#40
rhactl7

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You can be a selling league but not sell as soon as there is interest the player from Europe.  You can hold on to a player to try to win something, if that is what the team is primarily interested in.  RBNY is not primarily interested in winning.  They are primarily interested in developing players for Liepzig and Salzburg or for sale.

 

If RBNY's philosophy is to build a team of young players and then sell them as soon as they are ready to make the jump to Europe, the team will never be able to win in MLS because lots of teams have a core of players who are good enough to play in Europe but pay them to stay in MLS.  Lodeiro, Zelarayan, Morris, Nagbe, Ruidiaz, etc. all could play in Europe very easily but have spent some part of their prime years in MLS and that has led to winning teams.  

 

RBNY clearly is not interested in bringing in players in their prime of the quality of the ones I have listed.  The only way they will be able to win with a strategy of building a core young up and comers is to try to hold on to some of that talent long enough to build a cohesive unit that can compete for 2 or 3 seasons.  I am not saying you must try to prevent these guys from ever going to Europe but you certainly have to try to hold on to them until they are 21 or 22, instead of selling as soon as big clubs are interested or Liepzig wants them.

 

RBNY is likely not going to be a title contender next season, however, if Clark pans out like many people think he can, he could conceivably lead a title contender in 2022 or 2023 but due to the fact that RB corporate does not really care about building a title contender, he will not even get that chance. 

 

The bottomline is that RBNY's transfer policy very clearly is not primarily focused on building a winning team at the moment.  If they wanted to build a winner, they would not agree to part with one of their most exciting players a year in advance. They would wait and see.

I don't necessarily disagree with this, but I don't think this Clark scenario is relevant in this case. As others have mentioned, Clark and Adams were going going to Europe at a young age regardless of this club's strategy or not. 



#41
Efried

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Clark is being compared to the wrong people in terms of how long he should stay.  Dallas and the smurfs got nothing for blue chip guys like McKinnie and Reyna.  Brendan Aaronson played with Philly for two years just like Tyler did for us. Clark situation is different because he was a blue chipper AND essentially a free agent.  He wasnt going to staying for more than 2 seasons in any scenario
 
Frankly we've done well in terms of how long blue chipper stay with us and making sure they dont leave in the middle of the season.  we just mess up the other parts of team building, like having a striker that can kick the ball in the corner.

only reason Clark is in New York is because he failed to get a polish passport we are essentially getting free mls money because Leipzig wanted him

#42
Antonius Block

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Clark was going to Europe at 18 with or with out rbny. Rbny transfer policy is getting a full season from him. Tyler we got multiple seasons from. Prospects like that are not long for mls and you get what you can from them. These are blue chip prospects the market right now for blue chip prospects is all about moving them to Europe ASAP

Yes.  But the team sees little on field benefit from simply cycling through prospects.  Blue chip prospects only have on field value if you keep them long enough of them to turn into blue chip players who can contribute to your team.  I see very little interest from RB global in having blue chip players on the field for RBNY.  I see a lot of interest in using RBNY as a vehicle to get blue chip players on the field in Salzburg and Leipzig.  As long as RBNY exists primarily as such a vehicle, there will be little on field benefit from signing players like Clark. 

 

As MLS exists at present, to win you either need to sign numerous players who could play in Europe if they so desired or you need to develop such players and hold on to them long enough to build a winning team.  RBNY has shown little interest in buying such players, so they must develop and hold on to them.  No team has successfully done that.  RBNY has developed some of those players but it is becoming increasingly clear that they do not care about holding on to those players long enough to build a winning team.  


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#43
Eleazar

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I see very little interest from RB global in having blue chip players on the field for RBNY.  I see a lot of interest in using RBNY as a vehicle to get blue chip players on the field in Salzburg and Leipzig.    

 

Agreed. 


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#44
Efried

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Yes.  But the team sees little on field benefit from simply cycling through prospects.  Blue chip prospects only have on field value if you keep them long enough of them to turn into blue chip players who can contribute to your team.  I see very little interest from RB global in having blue chip players on the field for RBNY.  I see a lot of interest in using RBNY as a vehicle to get blue chip players on the field in Salzburg and Leipzig.  As long as RBNY exists primarily as such a vehicle, there will be little on field benefit from signing players like Clark. 
 
As MLS exists at present, to win you either need to sign numerous players who could play in Europe if they so desired or you need to develop such players and hold on to them long enough to build a winning team.  RBNY has shown little interest in buying such players, so they must develop and hold on to them.  No team has successfully done that.  RBNY has developed some of those players but it is becoming increasingly clear that they do not care about holding on to those players long enough to build a winning team.  

that interest gets us a ton of gam that we have used to lock down a guy like long or buy Parker and get a good window to win a cup and ccl. Even cycling prospects like Clark on has utility and honestly should start becoming the norm because it is what the players want to do and being the club that gets in young players ways is a losing proposition

#45
sabremike

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The great Harlem Knight had the best observation on RB FB: The strategy should be finding guys who are really good MLS level players who are going to top out at this level so they will be here long term.
Let's Go Buffalo!!!




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